The Boxscore Geeks Show (NBA)

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Direct download: bsg-172.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 11:10pm EST

We talk:-How the Morris Twins are ruining the Eastern Conference.

-How the Morris Twins are ruining the Eastern Conference.
-Why Ben Wallace deserved first-ballot Hall of Fame.
-Kobe's jersey retirments.
-Why NBA player rankings are silly.
-Issues with "Advanced Analytics."
-Rick and Morty.

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Direct download: bsg-171.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 10:24am EST

Also tune in for Rick and Morty vs. Game of Thrones! Check out for more tools and analysis.

Direct download: bsg-168.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 11:59am EST

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Direct download: bsg-167.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 12:50pm EST

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Direct download: bsg-166.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 12:52pm EST

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Direct download: bsg-165.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 12:25pm EST

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Direct download: bsg-164.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 9:43am EST

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Direct download: bsg-163.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 11:54am EST

Also some NBA Finals talk! Check out for more tools and analysis.

Direct download: bsg-159.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 9:39am EST

We also talk the NBA draft, the 2017 NBA Finals, and more! Tune in! Check out for more tools and analysis.

Direct download: bsg-158.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 9:24am EST

We break down: the second round of the playoffs, the future of NBA media, Lonzo Ball's shoe deal, my Kobe hate, and Moana vs. Frozen.

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Direct download: bsg-156.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 9:43am EST

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Direct download: bsg-155.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 2:33pm EST

Playoffs, playoffs, and more playoffs! Check out for more tools and analysis.

Direct download: bsg-154.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 10:18am EST

The Boxscore Geeks portfolio "final" results, a playoff overview, and some other random topics. Check out for more tools and analysis!

Direct download: bsg-153.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 11:20am EST

We review our preseason predictions, three-point defense, Steph Curry, and how silly the MVP race is.

Direct download: bsg-152.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 11:43am EST

Triple Doubles, grading NBA franchises, rest, Devin Booker, Nurkic, and more! Check out for more tools and analysis.

Direct download: bsg-150.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 9:59am EST

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Direct download: bsg-149.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 10:44am EST

Tune in to listen to Art Rondeau talk about his time as Allan Houston's shooting coach at the start Dolan-era Knicks.

Direct download: bsg-148.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 3:21am EST

Where stars are drafted, Russell Westbrook's opportunity cost, the Houston's offense, position schemes in the NBA, Sloan Analytics, and more! Check out for more analysis and tools.

Direct download: bsg-147.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 9:39am EST

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Direct download: bsg-146.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 1:38am EST

We talk: the Serge Ibaka for Terrence Ross trade, the Mason Plumlee for Jusuf Nurkic trade, and common stat mistakes. Check for more stats and analysis. 

Direct download: bsg-145.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 4:08am EST

We talk

  • Joel Embiid
  • Trading Melo and Cousins
  • More Dram in Chicago
  • All-Star Reserves

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Direct download: bsg-143.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 11:16pm EST

Is Joel Embiid a star?
Should the Wolves trade Ricky Rubio?
Should the Warriors be worried?
Jokic is good and do the Nuggets finally have a point guard?

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Direct download: bsg-142.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 9:53am EST

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Direct download: bsg-141.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 12:30pm EST

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Direct download: bsg-140.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 1:06pm EST

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Direct download: bsg-139.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 2:41pm EST

Dre, Patrick, and Brian are back! We talk the NBA CBA, CP3's MVP season, why the Warriors are as good as last season, and why Andrew Wiggins is bad.

Direct download: bsg-138.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 2:27pm EST

We're back with fire! The NBA and politics. Tune in.

Direct download: bsg-136.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 11:51am EST

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Direct download: bsg-135.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 6:05am EST

NBA News and more Kaepernick

Direct download: bsg-131.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 10:33am EST

Dre, Patrick, and Brian are back to talk Colin Kaepernick and some possible scenarios in the upcoming NBA season.

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Category:NBA -- posted at: 4:01am EST

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Category:NBA -- posted at: 5:43am EST

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Category:NBA -- posted at: 1:58pm EST

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Category:NBA -- posted at: 4:38am EST

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Category:NBA -- posted at: 2:04pm EST

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Category:NBA -- posted at: 3:36am EST

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Category:NBA -- posted at: 4:05am EST

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Category:NBA -- posted at: 10:40am EST

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Category:NBA -- posted at: 3:34am EST

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Category:NBA -- posted at: 2:07pm EST

The NBA Finals!

More NBA Finals!

Random rants about Game of Thrones.

full notes at

Direct download: bsg-119.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 8:41am EST

  • OKC/GSW Western Conference Finals
  • TOR/CLE Eastern Conference Finals
  • NBA Finals Preview

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Direct download: bsg-118.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 7:09am EST

Dre and Brian are back to talk the NBA Playoffs, the Draft Lottery, and a little Captain America Civil War.

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Direct download: bsg-117.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 1:40pm EST

- NBA Playoffs Round 2
- RPM and the state of analytics
- Defunct NBA franchises

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Direct download: bsg-115.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 1:27pm EST

  • NBA Playoffs Round 1 Continues, how will injuries affect them?
  • Lessons from the Portland Trail Blazers' "Improvement"
  • More than Mean

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Direct download: bsg-114.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 2:01pm EST

We talk the NBA Sixth Man and Defensive Players of the year, Steph Curry, Kobe Bryant, and, of course, the playoffs!

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Direct download: bsg-113.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 10:38am EST

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Direct download: bsg-112.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 5:17am EST

We're at that time of the year where some NBA teams hopes and dreams have been derailed; and then there's Batman v Superman.

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Direct download: bsg-110.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 5:46am EST

Coach Art Rondeau joins the show to talk free throw shooting.

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Direct download: bsg-109.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 9:55am EST

- Can the Draft Lottery compete with the Treadmill of Mediocrity?
- Ben Simmons falling draft stock

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Direct download: bsg-108.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 2:21am EST

Chris Yeh returns to the show and discusses his New York Times bestselling book, The Alliance, and it's principles apply to sports and other industries.

Direct download: bsg-107.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 9:02am EST

Brian and Patrick talk Curry's "overratedness", NBA positions, and Whiteside.


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Direct download: bsg-106.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 9:16am EST

- NBA All-Star weekend recap
- Recent trades and trade rumors

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Direct download: bsg-104.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 12:10am EST

More Cousins, more Curry, more DeAndre Jordan, more... Aaron Gordon?

Direct download: bsg-102.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 2:24am EST

It's the first show of 2016 and we can't resist looking into why the Lakers tanking strategy is a bad choice again. Dre thinks that Michigan State's Magic Johnson and Draymond Green would win a hypothetical all-time NBA Jam style 2 on 2 tournament between colleges, but our Twitch chat had other ideas. Dre is also fresh off watching the movie Concussion and provides his review, and we also talk Star Wars and other pop culture issues.

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Direct download: bsg-99.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 10:14am EST

Dre and Brian dig deeper into the 95-96 Bulls versus 15-16 Warriors time traveler grudge match debate, including some really cool three point shooting charts from Dre's article this week. There is also some Concussion movie talk and American Economics Association panel criticism.

Full notes here -

Direct download: bsg-98.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 6:51am EST

Dre and Brian assess the 2016 Basketball Hall of Fame candidates, Klay Thompson naming himself the NBA's best shooting guard, and hacking bad free throw shooters.

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Direct download: bsg-97.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 4:42am EST

With the NBA trade rumor mill heating up, we discuss why the Heat are in a tough spot with Hassan Whiteside, LaMarcus Aldridge's role in the Spurs historical season, and a "what if" with the Lakers and Ralph Sampson.

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Direct download: bsg-96.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 2:52pm EST

We give Boston credit for building the right way, unlike the 76ers and Lakers. Speaking of those teams, what's going on with the Jerry Coangelo hiring and Byron Scott's continued strange decisions? Finally, will Nike get good value form the lifetime Lebron shoe deal?

Full show notes here -


Direct download: bsg-95.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 5:33am EST

Dre, Patrick and Brian cover Kobe Bryant's retirement announcement, the 76ers first win, and this season's NBA rookies. -- Watch live at

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Direct download: bsg-94.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 1:33pm EST

Dre and Brian talk Kevin McHale's firing, Mark Cuban's trolling, Steph Curry's greatness, and the 76ers not as greatness.

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Direct download: bsg-93.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 12:13pm EST

We go over Dre's top 10 NBA box scores from last week. Who had the best, worst, and most interesting games?

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Direct download: bsg-92.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 8:17am EST

Dre and Brian break down the first week of the NBA season and go over some of our favorite tools and sites for looking at NBA data.

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Direct download: bsg-91.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 6:17am EST

Dre and Brian look at the most interesting NBA teams and stories heading into the 2015-2016 season.

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Direct download: bsg-90.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 1:41pm EST

With the 2015-2016 NBA Season is less than a week from starting, Patrick and Brian take a look at some of the final late breaking pre-season stories, including the Tristan Thompson signing and the annual GM survey.

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Direct download: bsg-89.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 2:20pm EST

Dre and Brian are back to talk NBA off-season, especially the hapless Kings, and more on racism and rich people.

Full show notes here-

Direct download: bsg-78.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 5:04am EST

Dre, Patrick, and Brian review the flurry of activity that has been NBA free agency week 1.

Blog link:

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Direct download: bsg-75.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 6:25am EST

Many NBA fans love following the draft each year, but not Dre Alvarez! Tune in for more draft hate and major sports media ridiculousness.

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Direct download: bsg-74.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 5:41am EST

The Warriors have a title and Iguodala was the "MVP"? The Pistons, Bucks, and Clippers make some savvy offseason trades. And the draft is a myth. Tune in!

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Direct download: bsg-73.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 4:19am EST

This week we talk the NBA Finals, how absurd LeBron's play has been, if smallball works, and how Bron compares to MJ and Iverson. Tune in!

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Direct download: bsg-72.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 4:21am EST

We talk the #NBAFinals, LeBron James' dominance, and the Warriors missing offense. It's another Boxscore Geeks Show!

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Direct download: bsg-71.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 2:32am EST

We recap the Warriors vs. the Rockets. Does the NBA have a problem with how it risks its star players? And LeBron is pretty impressive. It's another Boxscore Geeks Show! Tune in.

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Direct download: bsg-70.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 9:00am EST

This week special guest Justin Halpern joins us to talk the now defunct "Short Corner Podcast", the Cavaliers woes, the Clippers greatness, and even more NBA playoffs! Tune in.

Full show notes here -

Direct download: bsg-68.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 7:35am EST

Brian and Patrick talk the playoffs. Particularly how good the Warriors, how unacceptable Olynyk's move was, and how the Wizards used a videogame hack to advance. They also talk the NFL's charitable position and how Stephen A. Smith is a terrible human being.

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Direct download: bsg-66.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 11:23am EST

The Geeks talk the NBA playoffs. The Warriors are really good. The Spurs might be fading. The East is boring as heck. Tune in!

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Direct download: bsg-65.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 6:24am EST

Paul Shirley's back to discuss the NBA trade deadline, the defunct Short Corner Podcast, and more "inside the NBA" stories.

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Direct download: bsg-57.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 9:56am EST

James Dolan is terrible for the NBA, your backup matters in the NBA, and former players have amnesia.

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Direct download: bsg-55.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 9:56am EST

This Week's Show

How bad can the 76ers be? What we think of Charles Barkley's opinions on Ferguson. Finally, we have some opinions on the NFL and general sports reporting.


Video Show

This Week's Poll

Show Notes

The 76ers

The 76ers avoided starting the season 18-0! This derailed them from matching their worst-all-time losing streak.

This year's 76ers are "lead" by three average players. Not a great start.

The 76ers have done well not spending money poorly. Now, they need to start spending their money wisely.

Dave Berri's suggestion is to fire GMs that miss the playoffs for three straight seasons. So Hinkie's got a year to turn it around.

Charles Barkley and Ferguson

A few days ago, Barkley made some comments about Ferguson.

He doubled down on his comments.

Vox is great. And they had a good breakdown on how different races are treated in this country.

My first issue with Ferguson and some of the responses are how much U.S. history people have to forget when using the "looting and rioting is unacceptable." I tweeted a bit about this recently.

Also, the Boston Tea Party, the original racist American team?

Check out Idea Channel's video on the No True Scotsman fallacy.

I consider Barkley less of "No True Scotsman" and more victim blaming. Seriously, pants come up in racism discussions too much in my opinion.

Also, sorry, it irks me how much some people are upset by property damage, and how they gloss over human deaths.

It's worth noting rich and famous people have a skewed reality as Chris Rock recently talked about.

Reminder, Charles Barkley got arrested for a DUI. During this, he refused a breathalyzer.

Dave Chappelle's sketch on white collar vs. blue collar crime is hilarious. We could only find a subsection of it Youtube.

People do miss the disparity in lifestyles between rich and poor. They even miss rich vs. ultra-rich. "Millionaires vs. Billionaires" is the difference between $100 in your pocket and $100,000!

Sports Reporting

ESPN 30 for 30 is great. We loved many of them related to college sports.

  • The Fab 5
  • The Dotted Line
  • Unguarded
  • Roll Tide/Roll Eagle
  • Broke
  • You Don’t Know Bo
  • Survive and Advance
  • Elway to Marino
  • Youngstown Boys
  • Requiem for the Big East
  • Brian and the Boz
  • Rand University
  • The U part 1 and part 2

Sports news often has a problem with "very serious people."

We jump off talking about "Brian and the Boz."

Bosworth sold shirts to angry Broncos fans to "boo" him

We talk a little wrestling. Check out: "Beyond the Matt", "For All Mankind", and "Wrestling with Shadows."

Sadly, concussions may have been a problem for Bosworth.

PBS NewsHour talked about the NFL, concussions, and abuse.

Jonathan Weiler and the ESPN watch is great. We loved when brought up how bad ESPN's "journalism" was with an interview with Ray Rice's wife.

Aziz Ansari had a great sketch about being on the wrong side of history.

The tobacco industry in the 60s is a great comparison for the modern NFL.

Shout Outs

Dan Stryker ( is a talented illustrator and designer. He's also a fan of the show that demands more shout outs from Brian! Ironically, Brian's mic cuts out for most of it...

Great Tweet from Jeb.

LisaThinksALot is another great YouTube channel. Check it out!

Direct download: bsg-45.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 3:21am EST

This Week's Show

We talk about Kenneth Faried's popularity in Denver, the Boogie-Board, and the Milwaukee Bucks' hot start.


This Week's Poll

Penny-Arcade has one of the funniest comics on finding people on the net to help your confirmation bias...or not.

Show Notes

Kenneth Faried

Kenneth Faried isn't well-liked in Denver it seems.

I don't agree so much with the notion that players like Faried are outdated in the modern NBA.

It is my belief that without Dennis Rodman, Michael Jordan would never be considered the greatest of all-time.

Yes, the 1993-1994 Spurs were Rodman, Robinson, and not much else.

The Nuggets traded away Kosta Koufos, which was a terrible terrible trade.

As Dave Berri has noted, even a top three pick isn't a guarantee of a star.

Virtually every NBA player has flaws in their game. I find it's pick and choose as to when to use that label.

The Boogie-Board

Kirk's original work was in making shot charts. Since then Nylon Calculus has done a great job keeping that going.

At Grantland, Kirk Goldsberry has created a new metric: "The Boogie Board", which examines when players rebound their own miss and put it back in.

Kirk Goldsberry has done other similar stats, e.g. the "Kobe Assist."

DeMarcus Cousins is playing well this season. In spite of his "Boogie-Board" advantage, his scoring is good but not great. Sadly, his turnovers and fouls keep him from being a star.

My general issue with stats like these is they focus inward on what a player does well, without explaining the magnitude. As Brian puts it, "it's a fun fact."

The Milwaukee Bucks

As of this writing, the Bucks are 7-5 and a top four seed in the East.

The Bucks currently have four good playersGiannis Antetokounmpo, Brandon Knight, John Henson, and Larry Sanders.

The player I'm most concerned about is Brandon Knight, who was terrible his first three seasons.

More than a few hilarious videos about pronouncing Giannis Antetokounmpo

Shout Outs

Big Hero 6 was a fantastic film. The "That Thing You Like" podcast on it was great as well.

ESPN's 30 for 30 are amazing as well. This last week I watched "The Pony Excess", "Requiem for the Big East", "Survive and Advance", and "Youngstown Boys". I can't recommend these enough, and hey, free on Netflix! Also, tune in for a free rant on college sports.

League of Denial is a great documentary worth your time.

Dave Berri(@wagesofwins) for his great post on how college athletes are exploited. He has another great one up on why immigration is a good thing.

Iceman in last week's comment section gets a shout out for highlighting about individual defense and the lack of "LeBron stoppers".

Direct download: bsg-44.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 12:16am EST

This Week's Show

We talk about Anthony Davis' hot start to the season, Steve Nash's greatness, and why stats are hard.


This Week's Poll

Also, last week's poll ended up a draw! Good job Klay!

Show Notes

Anthony Davis and Hot Starts

Anthony Davis' current stat-line is ridiculously impressive. In fact, in the modern era, only two other players have matched it. Guess who!

The MVP award requires you to be on a contender. But with how Anthony Davis is playing, could he break the streak of needing 50 wins to get an MVP nod?

Speaking of surprising starts. As of this writing, Chris Bosh and Dwyane Wade are playing at star level, while LeBron and Love are not.

Of course, we've seen players start surprisingly. Chris Kaman started hot before regressing with Dallas

Al Harrington was once playing at "George Karl MVP level" (average).

Basically, it's hard to tell with small samples, and easy to overreact to stuff fresh in our minds. We'll have to wait and see.

Steve Nash and 'Simple' Stats

Steve Nash's facebook post on his injuries is just heart wrenching to read.

Based on Nash's points, the Mavs had an interesting point when letting Nash go. Essentially, it wasn't a question of if Nash could have kept playing ball, but if he should have.

I wrote a long post comparing Steve Nash to Kobe Bryant. It's really difficult to notice the small things that make Nash one of the greatest ever, and Kobe not at the same level.

Of course, this point was made long ago (about baseball) in the book "Wages of Wins."

Well, let's look at batting average. We see that Cobb's lifetime mark was 0.366. When Gwynn retired his career mark was 0.338. So Cobb hit safely 37% of the time while Gwynn hit safely on 34% of his at bats. If all you did was watch these players, could you say who was a better hitter? Can one really tell the difference between 37% and 34% just staring at the players play? To see the problem with the non-numbers approach to player evaluation, consider that out of every 100 at bats, Cobb got three more hits than Gwynn. That's it, three hits. If you saw every at bat for both players, could you see this difference?

We also talk the issue with athletes being honest with the media. Alex Kennedy summed it up best.

Shout Outs

Steve Nash(@SteveNash), of course!

I just watched ESPN's 30 for 30 on the Pistons aka the "Bad Boys". I have to give Bill Laimbeer a shout out for his great interviewing, great play, and the phantom call.

Direct download: bsg-43.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 7:01am EST

This Week's Show

To start the season we talk overreacting to small sample sizes. Our star player for this is Klay Thompson. We also talk the Lakers horrible start and the Cavs.


This Week's Poll

A note on last week's poll, it was inspired by the amazing Dante Basco

Show Notes

Small Sample Size Theater

I talk a lot about how I don't mind people "overreacting" to small sample sizes. Tune in to hear a rant!

Klay Thompson

Klay has started out the NBA season as one of the greatest shooters ever. While it's unlikely he'll stay this hot, if he improves his shot selection he could be great. The problem? We've seen several faces of Klay

And, of course, he's done this before! Sample size theater for the win!

Last night we saw more "Klay Classic"

Klay did get a "max contract" but in absolute dollars. This may actually make his contract more valuable come the new CBA. Of course, if the Warriors balk on another Kevin Love like trade, it won't matter. Also, even if Klay plays amazingly this season, it will not negate the fact that not trading him for Love and signing him to the max were subpar decisions. We've made this point before.

I can not find what Brian said that I thought would be a great title to end this segment. My bad!

The Horrendous Lakers and More!

The myth of Kobe "carrying" a bad Lakers squad is going to continue...

This is the Lakers worst start since 1958 when the Lakers started 0-7.

Currently, this Lakers squad is worse than the 2011-2012 Charlotte Bobcats (the worst winning percentage in NBA history.) The Laker's aren't this bad.

Kobe has no incentive not to shoot away. If he hopes to get another contract, he needs to keep up his image.

Reminder, it's not good for the NBA for the Lakers to be bad. In fact, recent moves by the Lakers, Bulls, and Knicks are bad news. The best teams in the biggest markets should be the goal.

Actually, we do know the origin to Nick Young's nickname.

Read Dr. J's autobiography! It's worth it.

Wow, the Cavaliers lost to the Jazz during this podcast. Maybe it's bad luck for us to praise the Cavs during the podcast!

Reminder, the Heat had an underwhelming start when LeBron joined. I'm not worried yet.

The Thunder are getting decimated by injury. For the billionth time, minutes are hard to guess.

Shout Outs

Bryan Mears for a great Tweet on Trevor Ariza! Also, sorry for snubbing Ariza, who is another great small sample size story!

Kenneth Faried, DeMarcus Cousins, and Rudy Gay all get a shout out for their amazing acting in a rare triple flop!

Justin Halpern(@justin_halpern) gets a shout out for the most recent Short Corner Podcast. He compared Kobe's situation on the Lakers this season the Kobayashi Maru. Or, the KOBEyashi Maru...get it?

Presidente for a great Tweet on Kobe's first finals MVP

Brian has the best conspiracy of all time. What if Kobe is a super-quant and has cracked the code to get paid? Brian's ultimate part of this theory: what if Kobe ghost wrote Basketball on Paper?

Direct download: bsg-42.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 9:34am EST

This Week's Show

Dre is back to talk: offseason gossip about Chris Bosh; Kevin Durant and his value to the Thunder; and Klay Thompson!


This Week's Poll

Show Notes

Chris Bosh

Bosh talked about how he had to sacrifice to play with LeBron. He gave this as a warning to Kevin Love.

Bosh landed a max deal, four all-star berths, and two NBA titles playing with Bron. He also increased his odds of making the Hall of Fame.

We, of course, questioned Bosh on this. And we found Bosh's game to be less diverse compared to Kevin Love's.

There is something to Bosh's point about feeling worse when you're not the best player on your team. Malcolm Gladwell has discussed this with colleges.

Kevin Durant's Injury

Kevin Durant is going to be out for six to eight weeks with a Jones' fracture.

No, the Thunder aren't going to miss the playoffs (if everyone else stays healthy).

This will provide a fun natural experiment. We've seen Durant without Russ. How will Russ do without Durant?

Klay Thompson

I remember! The reason this came up was Coach Nick and Arturo's great video on why Kyle Korver is the most consistent three-point shooter in the NBA!

I think Klay Thompson, based on his performance so far, is an overrated player. I think other players, including Kyle Korver, are much better.

Check out Nylon Calculus' great shot charts!

You are allowed to say a player is a good player, meaning their contributions help the team. You are allowed to say a player is talented, and that their skills aren't being properly used by the coach. However, they can not be both things simultaneously!

Klay may be a good defender in terms of impacting his opponents shots. However, his recorded defensive stats are not stellar. That said, I've often thought individual defense is overstated by many.

Anyway, with Kerr in control, Klay has no excuses this season!


Chris Baxter (@cbax), for an amazing comic on advanced stats and the eye test.

Raquel Rodriguez (@theplanetraq), who has made the great website, which debunks the myth Kobe is the greatest. It also has an updating clock of Kobe's misses!

You, the Boxscore Geeks fans. The fact that our comment section turns into a discussion about Rodman vs. Wilt in terms of rebounding just warms my heart!

Direct download: bsg-40.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 1:11pm EST

This Week's Show

Dre and Patrick are back to talk: the NBA's new TV deal, the upcoming CBA, and some over/unders for the upcoming season.


This Week's Poll

Show Notes

The NBA's TV Deal and Upcoming CBA

Explanation of new TV deal courtesy of Kevin Draper.

Lebron and Deron had some words about the new CBA because of the TV deal.

Patrick has some words on how there is no such thing as ballooning salaries.

I said the players should strike the 2017 playoffs. Astute reader AL_S pointed out that this is against the current CBA (page 328). The owners also agree to not to lockout, but, of course, why would they lockout the players during the CBA?

Durant just signed a show deal worth more than his contract!

The top players in the NBA have a lot of power. Dave Berri has suggested these players just start their own league to negotiate during lockouts.

The NBA made some major progress for players in the 1970s when the ABA was around. Haywood got the age limit removed. Robertson made sure players had free agency.

Players like Durant want to get rid of the max contract. As Patrick points out, the max contract is a misguided attempt to help the parity in the NBA.

The Cuban/Morey poll on last week's show is one of the closest we've ever posted. As of this writing, it's all tied up at 53-53!

Mark Cuban agrees on max contracts, but says if it goes, so should guaranteed deals. We disagree.

We end up talking a bit about Mark Cuban's thoughts on age limits in the NBA.


Going to Vegas to put money on our numbers has become a tradition for Patrick.

I have some thoughts on variance in predictions due to minutes.

Reminder, it's hard to win just fifteen games in the NBA. Only 27 teams in NBA history have achieved this. Of course, the Milwaukee Bucks did this last year, and I have recently relocated to Wisconsin...

Check out Basketball on Paper, which talks about slowing down the pace if you're a bad team. The 76ers have been going for an up-tempo pace though.

The 76ers did indeed trade for Bogans. Oh yeah, he's already been waived.

Patrick had some words to say about Sheridan Hoops thoughts on a few over/unders.

Patrick missed two of his bets by one game last season!

For your consideration: Trevor Ariza vs. Chandler Parsons career numbers.

Disagreeing with us is fine. We do get upset when your logic is inconsistent!

For your consideration: Thabo Sefolosha vs. Anthony Morrow career numbers.

The NBA Geek falls far from the tree. Patrick says his dad is smart, but that his NBA logic "makes Bill Simmons look like a Nobel Prize winner."

Here's what old boxscores used to look like (thanks Basketball-Reference!). It's not surprising people are in love with points!

Reminder, Scott Brooks is not a good coach!

Patrick remains confident the Wolves can crack 30 wins.

Patrick thinks the Cavs and Spurs should be overs. Of course, hard to know how much they'll rest their stars.

Will LeBron's new physique make him more dangerous?


I was on an on-line game show over at Channel Awesome(@ChannelAwesome) They were great hosts, and it was a ton of fun. I even talked some hoops. I'll let you know when it's out.

AL_S gets props for knowing the NBA CBA well enough to talk the no-strike clause in under five minutes of my post going up.

Daniel Leroux(@DannyLeroux) had both Patrick and Arturo on the RealGM podcast to talk the Southeast division.

RealGM(@RealGM) also gets another shoutout for having historical transaction information.

Direct download: bsg-39.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 8:33am EST


Patrick Minton(nbageek)

Produced by Brian Foster(boxscorebrian)

This week's poll

Show Notes

O'Bannon Ruling

The Ed O'Bannon trial recently came out in favor of "student athletes"

Jonathan Weiler wrote a great piece about Bob Bowlski(the Big 12 -- a non-profit organization -- commissioner) and his ludicrous statements about not paying athletes.

College athletics don't make money, or so they say. Of course, it's easy to not make money when you spend it all on athletic coaches! Following up Patrick's talk on this, our old post on this was using the same graphic used at Deadspin.

By the way, the idea that not paying athletes helps parity in college sports is just a myth.

As we've talked with Paul Shirley about before, the rules about how athletes can make money in college (e.g. side jobs using their image) are absurd.

Dave Berri has discussed that paying students to work in college is nothing shocking. He does it. Athletes are apparently different.

Comment Policy

As we mentioned in the thread for last week's show, we're going to be a bit different in the comments. While we do enjoy taking the time out to clarify questions/complaints about our metrics, methodologies, etc., some have abused this. Repeating the same thing over and over is just not going to fly.

Additionally, we've decided to start removing incorrect comments. We feel this is unfair to our readers, who may not realize a statement is incorrect. While we'd love to spend the time to correct/edit every comment, we don't have the time (see below for exciting reasons why). There are lots of people happy to tinker in this space. And that's great. But if your math is off, it will not find a place in our comments.

One last thing that Patrick didn't mention in depth is the length of comments. If you have a super long comment, I suggest you write your own blog post (even a medium as simple as Facebook supports this) and provide a link. Again, it's rough to edit stuff and while I enjoy the enthusiasm of long comments, they do monopolize the comment space, so they too may start getting deleted.

We've seen pushback before in regards to deleting/editing comments. What I will say is that this is our blog. We pay money and have put considerable work to make it. Commenting here is a priveledge, not a right. And the majority of you are great commenters with good insight. We've just seen a small rise in some issues we'd like to keep out of the comments. We hope it makes the comments a more enjoyable experience!

Player Options and Net Present Value

Greg Monroe and Eric Bledsoe may be "leaving money on the table" by only accepting their qualifying offer in order to become free agents next season. Of course, Monroe may never have gotten a good offer.

Patrick brings up the notion of Net Present Value. Namely, while a two contracts may be the same in total value if you accept less money now, in the long run you may be making less. After all, if Eric Bledsoe makes $100 million over five years, but in one case gets $15 million in year one and in another only gets $5 million, that's $10 million he can't invest earlier. And compound interest is amazing! Of course, there's also risk that Bledsoe's value may drop by the time he's eligible for a raise.

Contract negotiations in general are going to be interesting until the next TV deal comes through.

Patrick has some interesting thoughts about why certain players can age more gracefully (like Steve Nash). Tune in to hear more.

Coming Soon to a Boxscore Geeks Near You!

Patrick teases some new features including:

  • Historical Wins Produced back to the 1970s!
  • Javascript tools to make your own stats tables using Boxscore Geeks numbers!
  • More salary data!
  • Some updated stats unique to Boxscore Geeks. Don't worry, it's the same great math, just with some more ingredients

Tell Patrick how excited you are in the comments!

Shout Outs

Jonathan Weiler(@jonweiler) for his amazing pieces on the O'Bannon case recently. Seriously, checkout the ESPN Watch.

Josh Weil(@joshweil) has a similar name to Jonathan Weiler. And he's also an amazing NBA mind!

Arturo Galletti(@arturogalletti) couldn't make the show. But he has been working tirelessly with Patrick to get the upgrades we promised!


Intro Music - Test Drive by Zapac.

Outro Music - Take on Me (A-Ha), cover by Anni B Sweet.

Direct download: bsg-32.mp3
Category:NBA -- posted at: 10:24am EST